Rochester Gamers Community

**Interview originally conducted in April of 2007**

Recently I had the opportunity to sit down (cyberly speaking) with Travis Legge from Aegis Studios. Travis is the developer of the independent D20-based horror role-playing game known as Contagion. So let's get right to the questions.

For those that will read this and might not know about Contagion (which means they have not been listening to Tony and I – SHAME!), give us your quick and dirty explanation of the game.
Contagion is a game of Celestial horror in a modern world. On the surface it looks just like the real world, but in the shadows, the forces of Heaven and Hell fight a secret war for the souls of humanity. Demons use Hellspawn, their monstrous servants to torment mankind, while God relies on Slayers as warriors chosen from mankind and faithful Clergy to heal the wounds of battle. When normal folks find out about the War, they must either try to lay low and avoid the conflict, which is unlikely, or choose a side.

What made you decide to produce your own system?
A number of things. I have been a fan of the horror genre since I can remember, and I have always wanted to tell horror stories. With Contagion, not only do I get to tell scary and disturbing tales, I get to encourage other people to tell scary and disturbing tales with their friends. I get to inspire storytelling. There is very little on this planet cooler than that.

Did you always intend it to be a D20 product?
No. I spent about a year coming up with different rules and dice systems. I wanted it to be so unique and new. Then I realized that I could take the functional framework of the OGL system, adjust and tweak it to fit my unique vision, and have a final product that was familiar enough to appeal to people, but had my own unique fingerprint on it. Most gamers are familiar with the d20 system, which I think gave me a lot of freedom in creating my world. Players can delve into the unique flavor of the setting without having to learn, from the ground up, an entirely new dice system.

Talking with you a bit I know you are a huge comic book fan, so why go with a horror themed RPG?
Comics are my first love. Horror is a very close second. At the time when we were creating Contagion, I had a superhero comic in the works, which sadly never materialized. I actually have some comic work coming up this summer that I’m totally psyched about. It's called Shadowgirls. David Rodriguez, the genius behind Starkweather, approached me to pick up a few eight page short stories as backups to the main plot, so those should be showing up late summer/early fall. Shadowgirls is kind of a cross between Gilmore Girls and the Cthulu mythos, so while it's a comic, there are definitely horror overtones. Seems I just can't get away from monsters. I love them too much.

What do you feel sets Contagion apart from the rest of the RPG systems currently available?
Contagion takes several horror/fantasy standards and approaches them from a new angle. Our playable races are very different from what you have seen in other RPGs. We have tried to stay true to the horror genre, while making things fresh and approaching the characters, the setting, and the stories from an angle that you may not expect.

From a strictly systematic point of view, we have tried to streamline rules that we felt were bulky and unwieldy, as well as add in rules that give the player more control over his character, as opposed to relying solely on the dice. Contagion Points were a huge leap in my opinion. We have added racial challenges to make supernatural PC's more interesting and flawed. Also, we probably have some of the coolest class features, racial features and feats out there.

What made you decide to add the fantasy elements (elves, orcs, etc…) to your modern day horror setting?
All of the supernatural races in Contagion can be traced back to some form of demonic intervention. Our elves are the result of a terrible curse. They do not age and die, but they can never rest. Their sleepless eternity drives them slowly insane, but they are so afraid for their souls that they have an instinctual refusal to commit suicide or endanger themselves. The elves in Contagion are a pretty far cry from the nature loving, free spirits portrayed in the fantasy genre, and I think that gives them a horrific aspect. Horror is all about taking the familiar and making it frightening and disturbing. Making the safe unsafe. That was our goal with the standard fantasy races.

Can you give those of us that simply get to enjoy the game after completion a little insight into what you have to do to develop something like Contagion?
I smoke a lot. I spend countless hours in front of my Mac Mini, hammering out ideas, and doing research. I probably did more research while developing Virulence than I have in my 2 years of college. Everything in Contagion is based, albeit loosely, on real world beliefs and myths. I also sit around with the Senior Partners and bounce ideas back and forth, which is probably the most rewarding part of the process apart from hearing that someone played the game and loved it.

Are additional products for the system, for instance your recently released product Contagion: Virulence!, easier to make once the overall system is in place?
I find that each product is more challenging than the last, though I think that's largely self inflicted. Every time we set out to make a new product, we try to improve on the last thing we did. From storyline and system additions to art and layout, each new book builds on what we have learned before and reaches for loftier heights. We want our customers to feel that they are getting our best work every time. That is the challenge.

What was your biggest challenge in bringing Contagion: Virulence! to market?
That's pretty hard to say. There have been so many. The book was initially slated for release last year. My partners and I had some tragedies in our personal lives which led us to shelve the whole thing for about four months. That was probably the biggest obstacle. Trying to straighten out our careers and families while cranking out a book. Everything ended well though, so I can't complain too loudly.

What do you want people to know about Contagion: Virulence! or Contagion in general? What is its main selling point for you?
Contagion is perfect for people who like to see a vision of the world slightly skewed and twisted. It’s as if the part of the world that is under the lights is just as we recognize, but in the shadows, there are monsters. Things are darker than they seem.

Contagion also pulls no punches, and this is especially evident in Virulence. For a 130 page book, Virulence offers an amazing amount of system expansion, while still containing in depth setting and character material. I'm probably proudest of the "player's guide" chapter, which examines each playable class and tips for different approaches from a strictly role-playing point of view. And from a system standpoint, I absolutely adore Advanced Arcane Spellcasting. I think it's a pretty innovative way to deal with magic, and we got rid of "spells per day" which I detest.

I picked up the book as soon as it came out and I am enjoying my read of it so far. There is definitely a lot of new material that I can use for future demos during our gaming events.

I am glad to hear it! I can’t wait to hear how those turn out!

Now that Contagion: Virulence! is out are you planning your next project? Any hints for our Contagion fans?
Keep an eye on our site. We will have several adventure seeds coming out in the near future. As far as our next "Big" project, we will be focusing on the monsters in Contagion, the Hellspawn in our monster handbook, Hell's Henchmen. We are approaching Hell's Henchmen in a unique way, releasing each chapter as a standalone .pdf, for a very low price point. When it's all done, we will compile the chapters for a print release.

I think the fans will truly enjoy some of the monsters we are preparing to unleash, but I would advise that it's not going to be for the faint of heart. There's some pretty disturbing stuff in Hell's Henchmen.

You are personally running a Contagion game….What are a few of the mood songs for the night?
Yes I am. As far as mood music, I don't typically use it while running games. My group, as a whole, finds it distracting. However while writing I rely largely on 70's and 80's rock, punk, goth, and the occasional pop song. Everything from the Buggles to Type O Negative.

We have some tattoo fans in RGC…So how about a run down on your personal ink, Travis?
I have a smiley face with a bullet hole on his forehead on my right shoulder blade. It's pretty ghetto, so I plan to get it fixed soon. I have an upside down cross on my left wrist, a product of capricious youth. I was like 13 and a bunch of my friends and I got matching upside down crosses. How very metal of us ;)

I have a purple Decepticon logo on my left forearm. On my left shoulder I have a graffiti logo for the band Suicidal Tendencies. On my right shoulder I have the symbols for the Time and Entropy spheres from Mage: The Ascension. On my right forearm I have the Cobra logo.

My next tattoo is a toss up between the Shredder on my leg, or Skeletor on my left arm, with Old English lettering that says O.G. beneath it, because you don't get much more gangsta than Skeletor.

A few of our forum members had some questions for you as well.

ConanObrien asks the following:

How do you make sure that the RPG you develop differs from the hundreds of RPG systems already in play?
I rely mostly on my friends and playtesters. Between the group that playtests our books there is something like 120 years of collective gaming experience. If someone in that group says "this is just like "insert game here" I know I need to make changes. If everyone at the table says "That's awesome! I've never seen that before!" Then i know I'm on the right track.

How are you able to overcome the strict patents or copyrights held by companies if you try to make a combat system or anything else that closely resembles that of a RPG already published?
The Open Gaming License allows publishers to utilize the d20 system for their own publications. It's very similar to open source software. If you visit the Wizards of the Coast website, you can find out exactly how all that works. It’s a little complicated, but the short version is that there are options there for publishers.

skeloric wants to know about these issues:

Have there ever been any particular problems associated with the open game license that were event slightly troubling?
Not with the OGL, no. The d20 system trademark license is an entirely different beast though. Basically, anyone can use the OGL system, with extreme creative freedom. However if you want to put the d20 system logo on your book, you have to acquire a separate license, which places severe restrictions on the type of content you can produce. This is why you don't see the d20 system logo on Contagion books.

Does writing up a product to use the D20 system ever seem extraordinarily difficult or has it ever felt a little unrewarding?
No, actually it’s quite the opposite for me. I'm one of those gamers who likes to bitch. I like to sit there and say, "Well this rule would be so much better if it was THIS way." So when we decided to use the OGL to make our book, it was a chance for me to go and fix everything that I thought was broken in the d20 system.

What other system would you like to write something for if you had the chance?
I would love to write for Shadowrun. It's one of my favorite RPG settings of all time. I would also like to work on any of the World of Darkness stuff. Mutants and Masterminds would be a thrill, having the chance to unite my love of comics and my love of gaming.

ang* would like to ask you the following:

I’ve played RPG’s for awhile now, yet there is always some where to learn more. Where do you start? How do you know you are not missing something?
One of the beautiful things about role-playing is that you never stop learning. Each time you sit down at a gaming table, it's a new experience. Don't worry about memorizing a million systems. That's what books are for. To quote Henry Jones, Sr. "I wrote them down so I wouldn't have to remember."

That said, when writing a Contagion book, I spend countless hours cross referencing previously completed material for continuity. Big publishers have editors whose entire job is making sure that their published material is internally consistent. If anyone is looking for an unpaid internship...lol

Big projects generally run on timelines and are set-up in phases or stages. What are the timelines and phases of development?
Typically I have an idea and I toss it around with Darius McCaskey and Toy Cesar. Once we come up with a solid vision of how the book is going to be, I write it and pass it off to Darius for editing. During that process, we recruit artists and an Art Director, who help us create the visual aspects of the book. As the project nears completion, we start with press releases, teasers, and the like, then finally, publication.

This type of development is obviously too big for one person. With so many aspects of game development how is the number of people decided for a project?
We work with what we have. Back when we did Living Dead, it was all me, Darius, and Jason Huntress for the most part. Dean Petty did a bit of pickup writing, but that was a pretty small project. If you check out the credits page on Virulence, you can see that a lot of people came together to make it an awesome book, but we still could have used more hands. You can’t really have too much help, as long as the project is directed with a clear vision.

I don’t see a lot of BA’s for game development outside of the computer technology. What kind of an education does it take to work in such a field?
Most people would suggest an English degree I suppose. Honestly, in my experience, the best education is getting out there and doing it. Self-publish, find cheap freelance work, write, write, write, and build a portfolio of your writing.

I’ve actually played Contagion now, so I ask you. What’s your favorite character?
That's a really tough question. I would probably say my favorite race is the werewolf. Contagion werewolves are tortured, chaotic, emotional messes trying to survive despite their uncontrollable urges to engage in slaughter and mayhem. I think that werewolves are a great metaphor for the struggles people go through with their emotions every day, just on a much larger scale.

My favorite core class is the Arcane Student. I think they have incredible versatility, and can compliment any party of characters. They also tend to be in the know, and I have always enjoyed empowered and smart characters in horror.
My favorite advanced class is probably the Magus. I love wizards and sorcery, and I think we have created a very unique class in the Magus, with some pretty cool societies of magic study. I also think that the Advanced Arcane Spellcasting system is phenomenal.

Travis, thank you for taking the time to answer a few questions for Rochester Gamers' Community. We appreciate your time and your game. Every demo I have done for Contagion has been met with appreciation for the game, so you definitely have a few fans in the Rochester, MN area.

Thanks for having me! It's been a pleasure!